baby stay yacht

Standing Rigging (or ‘Name That Stay’)

Published by rigworks on november 19, 2019.

Question: When your riggers talk about standing rigging, they often use terms I don’t recognize. Can you break it down for me?

From the Rigger: Let’s play ‘Name that Stay’…

Forestay (1 or HS) – The forestay, or headstay, connects the mast to the front (bow) of the boat and keeps your mast from falling aft.

Your forestay can be full length (masthead to deck) or fractional (1/8 to 1/4 from the top of the mast to the deck).
Inner forestays, including staysail stays, solent stays and baby stays, connect to the mast below the main forestay and to the deck aft of the main forestay. Inner forestays allow you to hoist small inner headsails and/or provide additional stability to your rig.

Backstay (2 or BS) – The backstay runs from the mast to the back of the boat (transom) and is often adjustable to control forestay tension and the shape of the sails.

A backstay can be either continuous (direct from mast to transom) or it may split in the lower section (7) with “legs” that ‘V’ out to the edges of the transom.
Backstays often have hydraulic or manual tensioners built into them to increase forestay tension and bend the mast, which flattens your mainsail.
Running backstays can be removable, adjustable, and provide additional support and tuning usually on fractional rigs. They run to the outer edges of the transom and are adjusted with each tack. The windward running back is in tension and the leeward is eased so as not to interfere with the boom and sails.
Checkstays, useful on fractional rigs with bendy masts, are attached well below the backstay and provide aft tension to the mid panels of the mast to reduce mast bend and provide stabilization to reduce the mast from pumping.

Shrouds – Shrouds support the mast from side to side. Shrouds are either continuous or discontinuous .

Continuous rigging, common in production sailboats, means that each shroud (except the lowers) is a continuous piece of material that connects to the mast at some point, passes through the spreaders without terminating, and continues to the deck. There may be a number of continuous shrouds on your boat ( see Figure 1 ).

Cap shrouds (3) , sometimes called uppers, extend from masthead to the chainplates at the deck.
Intermediate shrouds (4) extend from mid-mast panel to deck.
Lower shrouds extend from below the spreader-base to the chainplates. Fore- (5) and Aft-Lowers (6) connect to the deck either forward or aft of the cap shroud.

Discontinuous rigging, common on high performance sailboats, is a series of shorter lengths that terminate in tip cups at each spreader. The diameter of the wire/rod can be reduced in the upper sections where loads are lighter, reducing overall weight. These independent sections are referred to as V# and D# ( see Figure 2 ). For example, V1 is the lowest vertical shroud that extends from the deck to the outer tip of the first spreader. D1 is the lowest diagonal shroud that extends from the deck to the mast at the base of the first spreader. The highest section that extends from the upper spreader to the mast head may be labeled either V# or D#.

A sailboat’s standing rigging is generally built from wire rope, rod, or occasionally a super-strong synthetic fibered rope such as Dyneema ® , carbon fiber, kevlar or PBO.

1×19 316 grade stainless steel Wire Rope (1 group of 19 wires, very stiff with low stretch) is standard on most sailboats. Wire rope is sized/priced by its diameter which varies from boat to boat, 3/16” through 1/2″ being the most common range.
1×19 Compact Strand or Dyform wire, a more expensive alternative, is used to increase strength, reduce stretch, and minimize diameter on high performance boats such as catamarans. It is also the best alternative when replacing rod with wire.
Rod rigging offers lower stretch, longer life expectancy, and higher breaking strength than wire. Unlike wire rope, rod is defined by its breaking strength, usually ranging from -10 to -40 (approx. 10k to 40k breaking strength), rather than diameter. So, for example, we refer to 7/16” wire (diameter) vs. -10 Rod (breaking strength).
Composite Rigging is a popular option for racing boats. It offers comparable breaking strengths to wire and rod with a significant reduction in weight and often lower stretch.

Are your eyes crossing yet? This is probably enough for now, but stay tuned for our next ‘Ask the Rigger’. We will continue this discussion with some of the fittings/connections/hardware associated with your standing rigging.

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How to Tune a Sailboat Mast

Here are some general guidelines for tuning your mast’s standing rigging . please see our blog on how to properly adjust a turnbuckle before you begin. as always we recommend seeking the advice of a professional rigger for more specific tips and tricks regarding tuning your boat’s rigging..

Your boat must be in the water. Begin by just slacking off all of the side shrouds as evenly as possible, so that all stays can be adjusted by hand. Once loose, try and adjust all turnbuckles so that they are pretty much equally open (or closed) from port to starboard respectfully. Also go ahead and line up the cotter pin holes (if present) in the studs so that they are in a pin-able position. Now is also the time to balance out the threads, between the upper and lower studs of the turnbuckle, IF they are not even. Do this by unpinning the turnbuckle from the chainplate – BE CAREFUL HERE – to ensure the mast is secure before unpinning any one stay. Lastly, loosen all halyards or anything that may pull the mast to port, starboard, forward or aft.

1. Check by sighting up the backside of the mast to see how straight your spar is side to side. You can take a masthead halyard from side to side to ensure that the masthead is on center. Do this by placing a wrap of tape 3′ up from the upper chainplate pin hole on each upper shroud. Cleat the halyard and pull it to the tape mark on one side, mark the halyard where it intersects the tape on the shroud. Now do this to the other side, the mark on the halyard should also intersect the tape similarly. Please note: when the mast is equipped with port and starboard sheaves, instead of just one center-line sheave, it will appear slightly off to one side. Just keep this in mind……

2. Using the upper shrouds as controls, center the masthead as much as possible using hand tension only. Some masts are just crooked. If yours is(are) crooked, it will reveal itself when you loosen all of the stays and halyards initially and sight up the mast. Although you should use hand tension only, you can use a wrench to hold the standing portion (the stay portion) of the turnbuckle. If for some reason the shroud is totally slack and you still can’t turn the turnbuckle by hand then the turnbuckle may need to be serviced, inspected, and maybe replaced.

3. Tune the mast from the top shroud on-down, making sure the mast is in column. Remember: as you tension one shroud by adjusting the turnbuckle, to loosen the opposing shroud the same amount.

4. Once the mast is fairly straight from side to side, tighten the shrouds all evenly using tools for tensioning. Typically, for proper tension, the shrouds should be tightened using these guidelines; uppers are the tightest, and then fwd. lowers, then the aft lowers and intermediates should be hand tight plus just a turn or two. ~ With an in-mast furler it is recommended to tension the aft lower a bit more to promote a straighter spar (fore and aft) for better furling.

5. Now you can tension the aft most backstay (s). If the backstay has an adjuster it should be set at a base setting (500-1000 lbs). If the backstay simply has a turnbuckle then it should be tightened well. After this has been done, in either situation (adjustable or static backstay), one should site up the mast from a-beam and notice that the masthead has a ‘slight’ aft bias. If there is no aft bias, too much, or the mast is inverted (leaning forward), then the forward most forestay (s) will most likely need to be adjusted to correct this. If a furler is present then seek the council of a professional rigger or refer to your furler’s manual for instructions on how to access the turnbuckle if there is one present.

6. Finally, sight up the mast one last time and make any necessary adjustments.

7. MAKE SURE ALL TURNBUCKLES AND PINS HAVE COTTER PINS AND ARE TAPED NEATLY TO PREVENT CHAFE!

Read HERE for how to use a LOOS & Co. Tension Gauge!

Here is a little vid from our friend Scott at Selden Masts (click the link then hints and advice for more info) on rig tune…..

[youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rcCALZ4x6R4&w=420&h=315]

Is your mast fractionally rigged, only has a single set of lowers or is just plain different? Be sure to leave any questions or comments below.

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61 Comments

Hi, I have a masthead 3 swept spreader adjustable backstay Evelyn 25 and I have been trying to find information on rigg tuning for this boat with no luck. Closest thing I come up with is a J24. Can you shed any light or point the way on tuning this great boat?

Thanks for the read and for reading the comment section first. Evelyn’s were great boats, still are if maintained. You say you have 3 spreaders?? That would be unusual for that LOA. From What I recall about the Evelyn is the spreaders are not swept aft at all, but straight out. Correct me if I am wrong and if different send us some pics to [email protected] to discuss further.

One thought is have you played with headstay length? So with back stay adjuster all the way off, the headstay should be very slack and the mast should be very straight up and down when looking at the boat from a-beam. If not, adjust the headstay and the backstay length to achieve a straight mast with almost NO rake.

The other tips are, as you’ve read, ensure the static tune is correct, e.g. masthead centered and the rest of the rig is in column. As for tension, since it is a race boat, start with the lowers and the intermediates pretty soft. Next go sailing close hauled and adjust leeward shrouds as needed to {just} remove slack, count the turns, tack and add the same amount of turns on the other side. The shrouds should go slack in the puffs, and in the really light stuff set the rig as light as you are comfortable with…then maybe take another turn off ;-0). You can purchase a Loose tension gauge to THEN start recording the various tensions at various wind/ wave conditions, make a chart for ease of future duplication.

The next step, if you can, gauge yourself off of another Evelyn25, beating and running, that would be ideal. If not other Evelyn 25’s are available, pick a similar design to match. Then see if your lower/slower, going upwind, or higher/slower, going down wind. If you can narrow things down to being a specific problem it will help you begin to identify the fix; which could be rig tune, sail/ boat trim, the sail themselves, or any combination thereof. Fix the rig tune 1st, then the sail and boat trim, then once you are feeling pretty good about that…..get some new sails!!!

….all of this taking into account that the hull and it’s foils are clean and fair.

Win the start, then extend your lead.

Great article to start with, I too am looking for some tips to tune my Evelyn 25. The 1rst year I rigged and tuned the mast the boat seemed very fast, (of course I didn’t write anything down). The next year did not have the same results, in fact it was terrible. Apparently I didn’t remember what I did the 1rst time. I’ve read through a bunch of the questions trying to glean tidbits from here and there, but need a little help. I have a 3 swept back spreader mast, with adjustable backstay . Any insight would be greatly appreciated

I have a fractional rig with a cap shroud and one lower V1. The spreaders are swept aft with no backstay, and the rig is set up for a fathead main. The worse diameter is 5mm. The boat is 23 feet long. Could you provide any tuning advice for this style of rig. The past owner said he set the rig up at 10% breaking strength on the upper and 4% on the lowers which seemed really low for this style of rig. Any input would be very helpful as we go to rig the boat tomorrow

If you look at our reply below for the FarEast 23R tuning explanation, this should help shine some light on the topic. As far as percentage of breaking strength is concerned, just ensure a good static (dock) tune, then sail-tune setting tensions to the minimum requirement, and don’t exceed 30% of breaking strength.

Cheers, ~T.R.C.

Any hints with tuning a sportboat that only has a set of uppers, a short forestay and no backstay????

Just got an email from someone else with almost the same question, for a FarEast 23r. Since I don’t know what Sport boat you have, I’ll just copy and paste my reply here. Generally, these “guidelines” work for just about ANY type of sailboat. The article is trying to focus on the concept of mast tuning rather than specific numbers, but also touch on how a guide can be created that is specific to YOUR boat and your style of sailing.

Thanks for the comment and enjoy the read.

“The Fareast 23r looks like a fun boat and simple in terms of rigging. I am a bit surprised that there isn’t any real support offered to the aft end of the top of the mast given the masthead kite. The boat must sail at enough of an angle downwind when loaded that the main leech and vang support the masthead….. but it must work.

As for appropriate tension, in terms of what’s fast, you will need to dig into the class a bit and figure out who’s figured out what. Ultimately the maker of your sails should have some data in terms of prebend for the mainsail and perhaps even jib luff curve (a.k.a. intended sag). If you can gather that info, I would do a static dock tune and then make adjustments until I achieve the sailmakers recommended pre-bend.

Additionally, you may be able to start with the Fareast 28r’s base setting for just V1 and D1 and try that to get started. Or at least see how that compares to the previous owners’ notes.

I haven’t’ sailed the boat but as a general guideline, and as you will read in the comment section of this article, you will need to start with good dock tune. The amount of tension is irrelevant at this point, contentedness and straightness is numero uno….. and then just the order of tension.

Order of Tension (Single aft swept spreader rig) – the uppers are the tighter of the two: upper and lower. The upper is in charge of providing you headstay sag (or tension). The lower will allow the mast to create mid mast bend, or keep it from bending. The forestay length gets adjusted to affect the mast’s rake, the amount aft lean.

Once a straight and centered mast with adequate rake and a touch of pre-bend is achieved (static tune), using hand tension only and you can’t tighten it ‘by hand’ any further, add three or four whole turns to the uppers and one full turn to the lower. If you have pre-bend recommendations, now check them and adjust as needed. Then go sailing close hauled, ensure you are trimmed and canvased correctly given the condition, and observe the leeward shrouds.

IF the leeward shrouds are flailing about loosely in the lulls, add tension by hand while sailing until they just begin to fetch up. Count the number of turns, tack and do the same thing on the other side.

IF the leeward shrouds aren’t slightly moving in the lulls, you’re likely a bit a tight and you should do the opposite of the above procedure.

For me, while sailing close hauled, properly trimmed, and properly canvased, if I see the leeward shrouds just starting to slack in the puffs or waves, then I feel like the boat’s tune is typically pretty dialed in. Then if I want to make cheat sheet “Tuning Guide” when I get back to the dock, I pull out my loose gauge, pen and paper and note: today’s wind and wave condition, and the Loos Gauge setting that I thought was ideal.

Soon you’ll have created the Fareast 23r Tuning Guide😉

Hope that helps.”

I have a 1965 Alberg 30. On a starboard tack the boat has more weather helm than on a port tack. I have not been able to achieve a balanced helm on either tack. New full batten main, new 150 roller furl genoa.

Other than the boat being evenly ballasted from port to starboard, e.g. holding tanks, fuel tanks, below deck furnishings, and storage items, I would check the rig from side to side. A crooked mast or poor static tune can result in the boat sailing differently on both tacks. A good way to test this is either sighting up the mast at the dock to ensure that the mast is relatively straight side to side and in column. You can also see that when beating (aka hard on the wind), you have to make adjustment’s to the mainsail sheet tension (NOTE: the traveler will likely need to be adjusted to mirror the same setting as on the previous tack). If notice that with the traveler in the same position on each respective tack that the sail is bubbling or flogging more on one tack than on the other, it is likely necessary to re-tune the mast. This can be done at the dock by following the guidelines in the article once the everything has been appropriately loosened to tension.

Let us know if this helps.

Any Hints, tips for tuning a 1977 Whitby 27 sloop 1/4 ton rig?

Nothing special that I can think of. Just follow the guidelines in the article. From what I can gather there are only a single set of lowers correct? Are the spreaders aft swept at all or just straight out? If it is single lowers and no sweep to the spreaders you’ll need to set the rake using the forestay adjustment to set the rake and the backstay to control the forestay tension. If you are interested in optimizing sail tuning, like in racing situations: higher wind sailing conditions will desire more tension on the shrouds, a bit more tension on the lower than the upper, but only slightly; and in lighter winds loosen them up a bit, a tad looser on the lower than the upper.

Hope that helps, and good luck.

How do I tune /2 in rigging. Neither of the loos gaug s are large enough?

Thanks for the question. Yes, I think the Loos gauges only go up to 3/8″ wire. First let me say that a tension gauge is not a must for proper tuning, more for tension recording and also not exceeding max tension which is typically hard to achieve without additional fulcrums or wrench extensions. Having said that, if you know that you need one simply search google for cable tensioning gauges. There are a few others like this one https://www.checkline.com/product/136-3E , pricing is not easily apparent and may be excessive for your needs.

My recommendation is that if you have a good local rigger have them do a static dock-side tune and perhaps sail-tune in the boat’s ideal conditions. Perhaps they can provide a tutorial on their process for you to be able to make rigging adjustments over time.

Hope that helps.

Hi. Nice article. I have a Mirage 27 (the Bob Perry design). It’s a masthead rig with single spreaders and the shrouds on each side come to the same chainplate. I have been tuning so that tension on the lower and uppers is the same and trying to set them so that (as you say) the leeward shrouds are just slightly slack. But how do I induce mast rake? I have a split backstay with a 6:1 purchase on the adjuster; should the mast have rake even with the adjuster off? or do I just haul on it? or should the tension on the inners and outers be different?

HI Michael,

You will need to lengthen the headstay and shorten the backstay. This can be done a few ways either with turnbuckle adjustment or actually shortening and lengthening cables, sometimes you can add or remove toggles also.

Hope that helps!

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I recently purchased a 1988 Catalina S&S 38 and experienced my first launch this season, including stepping the mast and tuning the rig. As we prepared, we found that the Cap Shroud and Intermediate Shroud were clamped together at the four spreader ends. The folks at the yard had never seen that, and I certainly didn’t know why it was there … possibly to keep the spreader ends and shrouds consistent? Anyway, as I am learning how to tune my rig, it seems to me that these clamps would prevent me from tuning the cap shroud and intermediate separately and correctly Thoughts? Should I remove them and re-tune the rig?

So it is a double spreader rig I take it? The upper shroud wire should run freely through the first spreader, or the closest one to the deck, and be clamped at the top spreader. The intermediate shroud wire should be clamped at the lower spreader.

Before stepping, if this was done correctly, both upper spreader and lower spreader should be clamped equal distance from the mast attachment point, when looking at the mast from port and starboard.

In other words, you should measure the distance from where the upper shroud attaches to the mast to the end of the upper spreader and it should be the same distance on the other side, port to starboard. Then the same goes for the intermediate shroud and the lower spreader. The upper shroud should run freely through the lower spreader although it is covered by the clamp, but not actually clamped at the lower spreader, j ust the top one.

If all 4 spreaders are clamped equally port to starboard. You should be good to tune from there. The spreaders should show a slight up angle, to be specific slightly more up at the upper spreader than at the lower, but all of them should be just ever so slightly pointing up. You even want to think about clamping them slightly higher than that before tensioning, as this will pull them down and into their preferred angle, just slightly up. Specific angles are really only determined on the spar builders drawing and vary for manufacturer to manufacturer. Generally it is pretty clear where they want to sit. With the shrouds loose if you find that angle that appears to be the right one, and push them up slightly from there then clamp. This will allow them to be pulled down slightly once tensioned.

Kind of a tricky thing to explain in writing but hopefully it helps.

Have further questions? Give us a call 443-847-1004, or email us [email protected]

I have a Catalina 275 fractional rig with single swept back spreaders and an adjustable backstay. My questions are: how much rake, tension on cap and lower shrouds and on chain plate should cap shroud be forward and lower aft. I am racing and want the best performance. Thanks for any help. Bill

If the two shrouds are on the same plate, right next to each other, and the pin holes are the same diameter, and the plate is configured in a fore and aft configuration, I would choose the aft hole for the lower shroud and the forward one for the upper shroud.

In terms of specific rake, you will need to look towards the maker of your sails and or the boat manufacturer. I discuss how to measure rake in the preceding comments.

“You can measure rake by hanging a small mushroom anchor from the main halyard, with the boat floating on its lines, if you wish”

For racing I would start off with a good static tune at the dock by following the points in the article. If you know it’s going to be light day, start off with light rig tension. Be sure to use either Velcro wrap style cotter pins or simply lash the upper and lower shroud turnbuckles together to secure them. This will give you access to removing the pins or lashing while sailing and adjusting the stays.

From there you will need to sail tune for that days specific conditions, your shrouds will tell you what needs to be tighter and looser. I have answered how to do this a few times already in the comments below, please take your time to peruse the comments section to see what sail tuning entails. Doing this will always ensure that the cable tensions are set up ideally for the conditions and the boat can be sailed at maximum potential.

“For racing, ideally once the static tune at the dock (the part we just talked about) is done, go out and sail tune. Do this by going hard on the wind and checking to see if the leeward shrouds are just starting to dance, this is ideal. If they are swaying about they are too loose for the current conditions. If the leeward shrouds are tight, they may be a touch to tight. Tension and loosen as needed; count what you did and to what shroud, then tack and do the same to the other side.

ALWAYS secure the turnbuckles when you are finished adjusting them.”

Just hit ‘Ctrl F’ and search the page for “sail tune” and “rake”

I am trying to tune a Hallberg Rassy HR36 masthead rig. The rig has two in-line spreaders. The cap shroud is 3/8 inch and terminates at the lower spreader. From the lower spreader, the cable transitions to a 5/16 inch cable passing over the upper spreader to the masthead. A second 9/32 inch cable runs from the lower spreader to the mast (just below the upper spreader). The Selden rigging suggests that the “upper shroud” be at 15 percent of the breaking strength of the cable. In this situation, is it 15 percent of the 3/8 inch lower portion? If so, how should the upper 5/16 inch and 9/32 inch cables be tensioned?

Thanks for your help.

Hi Bryant, good question. Once proper alignment and centering of the spar has happened (static tune), and you are perhaps a hair tighter than hand tight on all shrouds, you can begin to tension things to a percentage of breaking strength. Do this by using the cables at the deck and use their diameters to determine the tensioning amount.

The V1 (aka cap shroud) in your case is a 3/8″ cable which supports the two cables above ii, hence its large diameter. The 5/16 V2,D3 and the 9/32 D2 total 19/32. So if 15% of the 3/8 cable is achieved you will below that threshold for the cables aloft. Does that make any sense?

With that in mind there is a range of acceptable tension from light air to heavy air. 15% sounds like a good middle of the road tension. Generally you do not want to exceed 30%. Sail tuning in ideal conditions is generally the best way to determine the right tension, but 15% of breaking strength sounds like a good place to start.

Don’t forget your cotter pins and tape, especially aloft.

Hope that helps and thanks for the question.

T.R.C. Thanks you for the clarification regarding the V2,D3 and D2 load distribution. When I set the V1 tension to 15%, the tension on the V2,D3 was at 8 %. I then tensioned the forward shroud to 12 % and the aft shroud to 10 %. Then I tensioned the backstay to 14 %. After doing this, I measured the tension on the V1 to be 10 %. The only information I could find regarding tension on the D2 was that is did not have to be tensioned much. I tensioned it to 5%. The mast sights straight and I used a bossen seat on a halyard to measure to the lower part of the V1, which also indicated that the mast was straight. Did I overtension the fore and aft stays? Is the tension in the D2 too much or too little? Again, I appreciate your advice.

When you tighten the backstay it usually induces a bit of aft bend in the mast which will soften the upper shroud (V1) a bit. You can just take up on it again to get it back to 15% if you like. As I said there is a acceptable range for all of the stays, which you are well within. Everything else sounds like you did a pretty good job. Next up sail tune and see if there is excessive waggling on the leeward side, but in moderate breeze. The shrouds will begin to sway as the breeze builds, this could be a telltale to either reduce sail a bit or you can add some tension to the shrouds all the way around.

Should be all good as they say.

T.R.C., your advice has been invaluable. I took her out in 12-15 knots and was very happy with the sail luff and stiffness of the rig. Thanks for you help!😁⚓️

Hi , can you provide any tuning guides for a Swan 38 Tall mast single spreader rig with baby stay, I am keen to set the rig up for new North sails and race her competitively. The mast is an exact Nautor factory replacement in 1998. She shall not have furling sails.

Hi Peter and thanks for the comment.

Unfortunately we do not have a guide for that boat. I would ask the sailmaker however to see what info he or she might have. Alternatively you can always start with a good static tune and then sail tune the boat as I describe in some of the comments below. This is the best way. I may use a Swan 45 Tuning guide as the template and then just fill in my own numbers over time. This is ideal, but infidelity start with asking the sailmaker you are working with, he should have some good info.

This may seem like a silly question, but it has me perplexed. How long should my cotter pins be? Long enough to ‘jam’ against the surrounding body, to prevent rotation? Otherwise, I don’t see how they’ll prevent my stays from loosening.

The length should be the minimum amount to just be able to bend the legs. Too long and they get caught up on things, too short and you can’t adequately bend the legs to keep the pin in place. The head of the pin is a actually providing the security.

Does that help?

Great article to get me started, thanks! I just have a few questions…

I originally owned a Tanzer 7.5. Her mast was rigid and simple to tune with a LOOS and an eyeball. I however now own a Mirage 33 (1982) and things are a bit more complex (but not too much). When I bought her the mast was already stepped and the owners said they replaced the forestay (inside the furler) 1 season ago. I went about the boat tuning the rig as best I could but I started second guessing the rake. I found noticeable rake in the mast with virtually no backstay tension on. So I think my forestay stretched (being “new”) and I need to bring it forward.

How do I measure how much rake (at rest on the tensioner) is enough? With my rig as is I felt worried that if I pulled down on the backstay tensioner I might buckle my mast by bending it too far. It seems to me it’s ALOT of downward pressure on the column when you pull down on her especially if the mast was already raked or maybe in my case leaned too far back to start? She has a babystay too, I wasn’t sure how far to tension that other than to assist adding bend\rake but since I had too much already I just lightly tightened it and hoped for the best!

Thanks for the question. With the backstay tensioner completely off, you should be able to adjust the static/ base tension of the backstay with a turnbuckle (s). Loosen the Baby Stay so that it is completely loose, sloppy, to take it out of the equation. Then mark furling line spool direction and remove the line. Next, open the furler up to gain access to the turnbuckle inside, if present. Remove all cotter pins or locking nuts to free the turnbuckles on the headstay and the backstay. You should then loosen things so that the headstay and the backstay can be adjusted by hand. Close the headstay turnbuckle and open the backstay turnbuckle to reduce rake, and vice versa if wanting to add rake.

You can measure rake by hanging a small mushroom anchor from the main halyard, with the boat floating on its lines, if you wish. Then once you achieve the desired mast rake go ahead and tension the forestay and backstay a few turns equally with tools; not too tight, but a good base light air setting, or as loose as you can imagine the headstay ever needing to be. Lastly, tension the baby stay a bit until it just starts to tug on the mast, helping induce bend. From here the backstay tensioner will do the rest: wind it on and it will tension the headstay and induce mast bend via the baby stay. You may have to take the boat sailing and adjust things as you find out how it performs at various degrees of rake and bend.

I hope that’s not too wordy, but helps explain it all a bit. Feel free to email or call with further questions.

Regards, ~T.R.C.

Can you provide some specific information regarding rig for 1980 C&C 32. Looking to purchase new main and want to get the most from it for Wednesday nights. Boat currently does not have a pony stay, it has been removed. Can replace that track/car. What should initial bend look like, keel step is fixed so assume I need to some chock aft of mast at deck? Have rod rigging but no Loos gauge for same, should I acquire one? Love this site, very helpful RayK

Thanks for the compliment. This may be less technical than you might expect. I would start with the basic guidelines given in the article to ensure a good base, static tune setting. A Loos gauge is good but not needed. If you focus on getting the spar straight, side to side, with a slight aft bias and then the tension is set so that it feels fairly tight. I know that sounds vague, but keep this in mind: if you are anticipating heavier wind make things a bit tighter, and loosen things up if less windy. The order of tension, in regards to the which shroud (upper vs intermediate vs lower) is important; more so than the amount of tension. Make sure nothing is so loose it is just flapping about.

The headstay should have some good slack to it with the backstay adjuster totally off. Adjust the backstay and headstay turnbuckles, with them in the slack position until the masthead is favoring a slight aft lean or rake, but only slight. From there, tension the backstay adjuster very tight and see what the headstay tension feels like, should be very tight.

PLEASE NOTE: if the backstay adjustment is totally bottomed out at this point, the backstay needs to be shortened a bit. Just pay attention to how this affects the rake. …

This part is where the pony stay or the baby stay will play a critical part, for mast bend. You may even find the pony stay to be good for mast pumping in light air and waves. Making this baby stay removable is a good idea, as well as, we’ve found that Dynema rope is the best choice here.

So… a centered mast head, side to side. A straight, in column mast from the top on down. A slight aft rake to start with…and as you begin to wind on the backstay and the baby stay you will add some rake but also a good bit more bend.

Take this set up for a few test sails and see how things act, in different conditions. After that you can make some adjustments here and there as needed: weather helm, shroud tension, mast rake, pre bend, etc…Moving chocks and using a Loos gauge.

ADDT’L TIP: Chocks and mast step position affect bend and rake properties. Want more rake? Chock mast aft in collar and move step forward. Want more bend? Chock mast forward in collar and move mast aft. As all things, there is more to it than that, but that’s the gist of the whole chocks and mast step thing…

“Sail Tuning” is a blog we are in the works of, but the punchline is that if hard on the breeze, and the leeward shrouds are excessively loose, and you are sure you aren’t over canvased…then go ahead and take turns on the leeward side until they just stop waggling, count what you’ve done, tack and mirror the turns on the other side.

Once the boat is set up for that specific condition, and you return to the dock, you should take your loose gauge and record these settings…creating a tension gauge setting for various conditions.

Hi, Thanks for your information. I have a Dehler 34. 1986… How much mast prebend and rake is recommended? The boat is new to me in March. Raced ok but I want to get a new main and want it to fit a well tuned mast. What do you think of a 2 degree rake and 4″ prebend at the speaders? Also, I have a Harken furler, How do you measure the forestay tension? Thanks, Duke

The answer, this boat is pretty sporty so it should show some rake. The spreaders are swept slightly aft so this will produce some natural bend just to tension the headstay.

Head-stays are always tough to measure with any sort of gauge, there are some class specific tricks for using a gauge in funky ways in order to get data, but they aren’t really reliable in my opinion. If you live in a typically windy area, go for bit more shroud tension, headstay tension and mast bend, and see how the boat feels. This will take some trial and error. If the forestay feels too stiff, slot too tight, loosen the uppers a bit, thus reducing bend and slackening the headstay.

Once the boat is sailing well in the ideal conditions, record that bend and those tensions. This is where I would leave things set, record it, and then just adjust shroud tension to affect bend and headstay in order to compliment different wind strengths and sea states. It takes quite a bit of back and forth, and documentation to get it right. One designers have already worked all of this out and then they share it for others…..very helpful. The rest of us will have to be the trailblazers for this type of information for other boat owners with the same (similar) boats to benefit.

Hope that helps, thanks for the kind words, and good luck. Once you figure things out post a link here for others with the same boat…..would be helpful.

Hello, Thanks for all of this great info. I just purchased a 37′ boat with a 3/4 fractional rig and a tapered mast. I was wondering if there were any special considerations when tuning the fractional rig? Currently the stays and shrouds are a little loose and can be wiggled (borderline flopping) by hand although the mast stands and is visually centered. (We are in SW Florida and the boat went through a direct hit by hurricane Irma like this and still stands tall!) Also is it advisable to increase shroud tension in small increments first on one side and then do the same on the opposing side? Thanks so much for any info

Hi Nathan. There are some thoughts, so fractional masts are usually fitted with aft swept shrouds and spreaders. If so, this means that the uppers also tension the headstay and create mast bend. The lowers then also act to reduce mast bend, so the tighter you make them you are actually reducing mast curve, thus powering the mainsail up. So be conscious of these two thoughts when tensioning the shrouds. The rest is fundamentally the same as the guide suggests. Loose or wiggling shrouds (excluding the scenario where we are talking about the leeward shrouds under sail), should be tightened. Doing things in increments is definitely a good idea.

Hope that helps. Thanks for the questions.

Thanks!! Now that you say that about the swept spreaders helping create mast bend it makes perfect sense. I had an ‘oh duh’ moment. I’ll probably err on the side of looser lower shrouds knowing if we need more power we can always tighten them up. Thank you again this helped immensely!

I want to buy a tension gage. Most familiar with Loos. But do I need Pt 1 or 2? (Pretty sure I don’t need 3 or Pro.) I have two rigs to tune: a 1972 Morgan 27 and a Catalina 22, I think 73 or thereabouts. The Morgan 27 is mine, fresh water for life, and 99.9% most likely factory wire. The Catalina 22 is a borrower in the Gulf, but pretty sure the owner has never tuned it. My problem is I can’t find the gage of wire for either standing rigging anywhere! Any help?

I think this one will do… https://sep.yimg.com/ca/I/yhst-70220623433298_2270_120385950 . The Morgan is likely 3/16″ wire and the Catalina is likely 5/32″, that’s an educated guess. Hope that helps.

I just purchased a 1980 C&C 40. I was told that I need to replace the rod rigging as it is “too old”. The mast is down and the rod rigging seems ok but I have not done any penetration testing. Does rod rigging need to be replaced due to age? Thanks Rigging Co.

Not replaced, but re-headed. This can mean that some stays need to be replaced as a whole, but not typically not the whole set. There are instances where you’ve almost replaced all of it anyways, so full replacement just makes sense. Other than those scenarios, full replacement is due after a certain mileage with rod…60,000 NM. Please keep in mind these standards are very general recommendations. It sounds like in your case, you should send in the rod, tangs, and chainplates for service and inspection. once we receive everything we will make a quote for the recommended services and/or replacement.

Hope that helps and give us an email for more info.

I have had a problem with securing the spreaders to the shrouds, resulting in the spreaders dropping. I am using stainless wire to seize them but still having a problem. Any tips on how to do this properly?

Seizing the wire onto spreaders with hinged spreaders is a bit of a trick of the trade that requires some practice. We use the X’s and O’s method. The end result should be something that looks like this… https://theriggingcompany.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/2012-06-07_14-26-09_899.jpg?w=900 . A trick to make the wire bite into the spreader end a bit more is to wedge a small piece of leather between the spreader and the wire before seizing. Also parceling and serving the wire where it intersects the spreader will help create more bite too. Lastly, and I don’t like this method but you can install a bull dog cable clamp beneath the spreader, nuts facing in, to keep it from dropping when slack.

I hope that helps a little. Thanks for commenting.

I am struggling to get enough rake into my mast. 33 foot Charger 33 keel stepped. Have loosened forestay and moved mast foot forward by about 10 mm. Should the chocks in the collar be adjusted? Runners and 2 spreaders, and check spreader. Spreaders do not have much aft angle. Move mast step more forward? Outers are tight with inners looser. Thoughts?

Hey Bernard,

Yeah, it sounds like chocks are the last thing. Maybe remove the chocks with the rigging slack and see if you can get the mast to sit where you like it with just hand tension. Then chock it where it wants to sit. It sounds like you are on the right track everywhere else, perhaps add a toggle into the headstay and shorten the backstay is next. Good luck and I hope that helps somewhat.

Hi, We have a Lagoon Catamaran with fractional rig, upper and lower shrouds, fore stay and upper and lower diamonds. No back stay. The mast has a degree of pre-bend. I do not plan to drop the mast.

I may have to do some work on the port side upper diamond. Is it as easy as just undoing the turnbuckle? Or do I need to loosen the starboard one at the same time. If it needs replacement should I also replace the starboard one even if in good condition?

As a further question, what happens if a diamond breaks, does it result in mast failure?

You would need to loosen the other counterpart to that stay for sure. It is just good practice, will keep the mast straight, and also make your life easier for removal install. Now, do you replace both? I don’t know. How old is the standing rigging? Why are you replacing the one? If it is not all due for replacement and you are just replacing due to damage, just do the one, but loosen both sides to do this.

Hope that helps and thanks for the visit.

Hello! I recently purchased a keel-stepped 1982 Goman Express 30 which came with an Alado Furler. I have been sailing it since May of this year. My question is this: Despite relocating mast wedges at the cabin roof to bias the lower mast aft about 2″, I still have a pronounced backward bend (10 degrees or so) just above the highest spreader. When sailing on jib alone, most wave action causes the mast to pump right at the bend point. I have a split backstay that is as un-tensioned as possible and the forestay only has another inch of adjustment left. There is no baby stay.

How can I get the bend out of the mast? How concerned should I be that the mast might break at that point?

Thanks in advance for your reply!

Eric Hassam – Delta Flyer

Thanks for taking the time to comment on our site. It sounds like you are on the right track. So one other adjustment that you have is the mast step position. This greatly affects mast bend on keel stepped masts. For a stronger bend and less rake, move the mast butt aft. For more rake and less bend (probably what you need to try), move the mast step forward a bit. If neither of these help, you may be off to have your headstay shortened and this means it is too long. This is likely not the case, but it is a possibility.

Keep in mind….A mast should have a slight aft rake bias along with a small amount of mast bend. This is quite normal. You can send us a picture if you’d like a second opinion on if it is over-bent. Having said all of that, even if you remove all of the mast bend, the mast may still pump. This is a design flaw in many spar designs that lots of end users have experienced. This can be remedied by redesigning the stay lay out. Is there a place for a staysail stay and/ or runner backstays? If so add them. Is there a place for a baby stay? If not, that may be a consideration.

Thanks again and I hope that helps.

Hi, I have a 48 foot yawl with a 7/8 fractional rig, is the tuning procedure the same as a masthead rig? I seem to have trouble getting aft rake and proper headstay tension. Also, is there a particular tension number the upper shrouds should have? many thanks in advance

Hi Bill, thanks for taking the time. 7/8 is very close and I would treat it like a masthead rig, especially if the none of the spreaders are aft swept. Tesnsion the headstay using the backstay(s). This should pull the top of the mast aft. If there are any other forward stays, i.e. stay sail stay, forward lowers, or anything else that could be holding the mast forward, go ahead and loosen those completely. You then may need to tighten the Tri-attic (the stay that connects the top of the mizzen and top of the main) if present. OR if the mizzen needs more rake too, then lossen all forward stays and pull it back using the available aft stays for this as well.

Hope this helps and please email us and send some pictures if you need more help.

I have a 1972 Morgan 27, which has both forward and after lower shrouds. I wish to remove the forward lowers so I can trim a 110% jib inside the stays. I see a lot of boats without forward lowers and think this will work OK, but wonder if I should increase the size of the aft lowers and beef up the chain plates. Any suggestions?

THANKS FOR YOUR INPUT. I AM GOING TO REMOVE THEM ANYWAY AND SEE WHAT HAPPENS. “HOLD MY BEER, WATCH THIS….” FAMOUS LAST WORDS.

Lol! Good luck. Call us if you need assistance.

I have rod rigging on my Beneteau 32s5

Any other guidance on tuning them vs wire rigging

Hi and thanks for commenting.

Just follow the guidelines in the write up. The over all goal is that the mast needs to be straight and in-column when looking at it from side to side.

Fore and aft, the mast should show a very slight lean aft. Depending on whether or not the spreaders are in-line or aft swept; you should also see some slight bend if there is any aft sweep to the spreaders just from the tension of the uppers.

A Rod stay tends to run a bit tighter than wire, so keep that in mind.

For racing, ideally once the static tune at the dock (the part we just talked about) is done, go out and sail tune. Do this by going hard on the wind and checking to see if the leeward shrouds are just starting to dance, this is ideal. If they are swaying about they are too loose for the current conditions. If the leeward shrouds are tight, they may be a touch to tight. Tension and loosen as needed; count what you did and to what shroud, then tack and do the same to the other side.

ALWAYS secure the turnbuckles when you are finished adjusting them.

Pingback: Tuning a Sailboat Mast | ChesapeakeLiving.com
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Wow, I would hate to be charged by her for three trips up the rig and forget the screw driver the rubber plugs that are sacraficial and replaced everytime removed just to clean the stainless 1×19 rigging.

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Baby Stay setup, how does this one work?

Add to quote

Good question BF - I have a baby stay setup as well but its on two carriages that run ontop of a deck traveler that is about 4 feet long, free running at that for the length of the track.... so will be interested in hearing how to rig and use myself...as I am sure the principles are the same...

Dont know BF...the ones Iv seen have something similar like a Giant pelican hook and are fairly easy to rig /derig...thats what im going with anyway.

To me that just looks like the downhaul line stored by clipping it to the turnbuckle. The highfield lever style turnbuckle is what you would want if you wish to remove the stay from the deck quickly. See here: Solent Stay

Yep thats the one ...Thanks KH Bet your right about the down haul too..

Attachments

The ABI hyfield levers should do the trick... but CS Johnson makes some smaller, much more affordable ones. Depending on the load requirements, you might be able to use the CS Johnson ones...

I don't think the line and block have anything to do with derigging the baby stay. I can't see anyone using a line led over a hatch that way. I'm not sure what it's for but it's apparently just attached there temporarily.

The babystay on my friend's C&C 38 is on a small genoa track section and has a line-control setup much like a genoa car fairlead would. The car can be moved forward to tension the babystay or moved aft to ease the babystay. You could do much the same on your boat, if you made the babystay a bit longer and added a section of genny track just forward of that hatch.

Like Keelhaulin', I'm pretty sure that's just a pole downhaul stowed on the babystay fitting....

Yes, I think you guys are right about it just being stored there. I think the block threw me off. Thanks all!

BabyStays for Trailerables Most trailerable sailboats have a set of baby stays that attach to a hound about 6-7 feet off the deck and to the stantion bases at the beam. The same hound is used with a winch attached to raise and lower the mast, the baby stays keep the mast from swinging too far to port or starboard and twisting the mast base plate. The babystays are for keeping the mast aligned with the boat while raising and lowering. I realize there are other applications for them but this is one I know of from trailering.

I also think it's a downhaul either for the pole, or a downhaul for the staysail, just stored in that position.

Looking closely it appears that the babystay has a simple turnbuckle and the spin pole downhaul has been snapped onto the stay above the turnbuckle. Back to the original quiestion. A block and tackle at the end of the babystay is a very typical set up for babystays on smallish (under 40')raceboats with flexible spars. It allows precise mastbend similar to the way an adjustable backstay works on a fractional rig. The tackle can be quickly eased by the pit person on the leeward mark rounding allowing the stay to retract out of the way. There is often a shockchord retractor line that pulls the stay back next to the mast. Sometimes this is rigged as a cascade when more purchase is needed. A highfield lever makes sense for stays used to fly jibs offshore but makes absolutely no sense on a race boat of this size. Jeff

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Forums > Sailing > > General

Baby stay question.

TAS, 2446 posts

Hi all Went for a sail on a Sailmaster 845 yesterday similar to mine that a gent down here has just purchased and it has a baby stay (mine has not got one) It has a quick release fitting on the deck and didn't have a great deal of tension on it Going about was slow because the head sail kept getting caught on the baby stay and i was tempted to unclip it from the deck and clip it to a pad eye at the base of the mast but i was not 100 % sure that i was not needed It was only blowing 10-15 knots with the occasional stronger gust and the mast is a fairly solid section and we were only using head sail and mainsail Any thoughts would be appreciated Regards Don

QLD, 1194 posts

NSW, 1659 posts

Hi Donk. I have an inner forestay too that got in the way. I think it was Cisco who said to put it away.....so I did. I tied it to the base of mast and now it's so much easier to tack. Hope this helps.

QLD, 160 posts

My understanding is that in most cases, the baby-stay is there to stabilise the mast and maintain the correct bend. It may only be necessary in heavy weather or big seas. Given the significant disadvantages (when tacking, also taking up space on the foredeck) you can be sure the designer wouldn't have put it there without a very good reason. And while people do use them for additional sails, in many cases that may not have been the original design intention. You certainly wouldn't want to put a storm jib there without also adding running backstays to properly support the mast.

WA, 1576 posts

Hi Donk, I have a baby stay on my rig. I only have single inline lower shrouds so the babystay pulls a preload/bend into the mast to stop pumping. Having an adjustable babystay and an adjustable backstay allows the forestay tension to be easily adjusted . If I where to have double lowers it would be harder to change forestay tension and keep the mast looking good especially on a large mast section. Some rigs that use babystays also have checkstays to oppose its tension The boat sails without the babystay but the mast will pump as loads increase and as sea state roughens. I also have an inner stay for a staysail, that one is opposed by runners

MorningBird

NSW, 2662 posts

Don't confuse a baby stay with an inner forestay. A baby stay is not intended to run a sail, it is to stop the mast from pumping especially in heavy weather. The standard S&S34 has a baby stay. The problem with disconnecting it is, will you be able to reconnect it when the wind builds and it is needed. If you never (that is never ever) go sailing in anything over 15 kts you could probably disconnect it safely. I know from my experience that I can never confidently get wind strength right and have been caught in stiff breezes when not expected. An inner forestay does not always need running back stays. If the stay attached less than 10% of the distance from the base of the mast and the top stay fitting the existing back stay will take the loads.

shaggybaxter

QLD, 2531 posts

HI Donk, I run an inner forestay that is removable for running a staysail. Tension is adjustable. No runners or backstay opposing, but the mast/shrouds are really stiff. We run it for changing down gears from the headsail as we can't partially furl the headsail. The staysail ls on hanks on a halyard that enters the mast at the same point. It does foul the big headsail a bit when tacking. Overall, I love the concept, the whole setup works really well. SB

I have seen a few UFO34s with a baby stay attached to a track leading back to the base of the mast. The baby stay can be released and slid back to the mast out of the way, then retention from the cockpit by pulling it forward through a block and clutch. Some s&s 34s have a block and tackle at the bottom of the babystay. You can let it slack and feed it some rope to bring the babystay back to the mast and then tension it by pulling it tight when you have got the rest of the rig trimmed or have gone through the tack.

QLD, 294 posts

NSW, 1146 posts

My Mottle 33 had a baby stay and same thing, it made taking tacking a pain because the jig/genoa would get jammed on it. After short deliberation I took it off. The mast stayed there and tacking was great. Maybe it was meant to contribute to the mast bend, if it did the improvement in tacking speed (we were racing) made it worth the sacrifice. The only risk factor I could see was that if the forestay broke there was no backup to stop the mast coming down. But the rigging was new and that never happened.

VIC, 5814 posts

NSW, 7571 posts

I have a baby stay. I made a plastic conduit cover for it with plastic bearings made from a chopping board. Works fine.

QLD, 79 posts

Select to expand quote Donk107 said.. Hi all Went for a sail on a Sailmaster 845 yesterday similar to mine that a gent down here has just purchased and it has a baby stay (mine has not got one) It has a quick release fitting on the deck and didn't have a great deal of tension on it Going about was slow because the head sail kept getting caught on the baby stay and i was tempted to unclip it from the deck and clip it to a pad eye at the base of the mast but i was not 100 % sure that i was not needed It was only blowing 10-15 knots with the occasional stronger gust and the mast is a fairly solid section and we were only using head sail and mainsail Any thoughts would be appreciated Regards Don Hi Donk You may find the inner forestay is there for when you are on a third reef to prevent the mast from inverting Al

Donk its hard to know never found a lot of info on the sail master came across these a little bit of reading for you news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1300&dat=19760910&id=9e1UAAAAIBAJ&sjid=UJIDAAAAIBAJ&pg=4048,2466694&hl=en news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1300&dat=19761207&id=fU8QAAAAIBAJ&sjid=SJIDAAAAIBAJ&pg=6762,1972917&hl=en www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Sailing/General/beam-reach-boom-position/?page=2

NSW, 3334 posts

"baby stay question" started by donk107, send message.

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Thread starter Lee Hadjiosif
Start date Mar 22, 2014
Beneteau Owner Forums
Ask A Beneteau Owner

Lee Hadjiosif

I have a "Baby Stay" on my B381 that I would like to use to hang a storm jim if needed but not sure if it's designed for that. It also has a protective tube/sleeve for the first 5 feet or so that would have to be removed. I would hate to have to lower the genoa and raise a storm jib on the headstay in the storm. I know about the ATN storm jib that goes around the furled jib but I'm more interested in using the baby stay if possible. Any suggestions? Thanks Lee S/V Adagio

I have first 345 with the same baby stay. I think it is too far aft to be useful. I am looking at using the staysail pad eye at the tack and the topping lift as a halyard and hoisting the storm jib either in stops or on its own sniffer or similar.

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26-06-2015, 16:16
Boat: Norfolk 43	. Many masts would not survive without a baby stay. A serious 30 to 70ft cruising should never be designed to have a baby stay as it is a unnecessary inconvenience on a cruising . And that is the crux of the matter. The Bene's, as with most mass produced , are not designed for serious ocean cruising. This is not a Bene bash. I know that many thousands have successfully crossed oceans in most conditions but they are primarily designed to perform well a whilst still providing very well appointed accommodation. They also suffer from being built to a . It is cheaper to have a lighter section with a baby stay to help keep it up than to have a heavier section that would make a baby stay unnecessary. As with all else on a yacht, it is a compromise and in my opinion in this case the compromise has been for performance and economy over strength and user friendliness. In this particular vessel that was obviously the decision made.

26-06-2015, 16:37

Boat: Sold, alas, because life happens.

once told me that unless you are doing some serious heavy sailing it is not really needed. Thoughts? We would love to remove it but don't want to over stress the rest of the rig. We are not extreme and don't sail in anything over twenty knots and reef early and often. Anyway just trying to get a little insight into the possibility of taking it off and storing it below.

Thanks
Will

26-06-2015, 17:09

Boat: CSY 44 Tall rig Sold!

masts would not survive without a baby stay. A serious 30 to 70ft cruising boat should never be designed to have a baby stay as it is a unnecessary inconvenience on a cruising boat. And that is the crux of the matter. The Bene's, as with most mass produced , are not designed for serious ocean cruising. This is not a Bene bash. I know that many thousands have successfully crossed oceans in most conditions but they are primarily designed to perform well a whilst still providing very well appointed accommodation. They also suffer from being built to a . It is cheaper to have a lighter section mast with a baby stay to help keep it up than to have a heavier section that would make a baby stay unnecessary. As with all else on a yacht, it is a compromise and in my opinion in this case the compromise has been for performance and economy over strength and user friendliness. In this particular vessel that was obviously the decision made.

26-06-2015, 19:36
Boat: Norfolk 43	make some shortcuts in the or whatever but not in the rig, the mast is wonderfull , proper suported and with generous sizes in the uppers and lowers , they fit a babystay because the angle in the sweep back spreaders is not enough to keep the rig stable in the midle section without the babystay in regular weather, its a sparcraft not a zSpar my friend. Was there only one choice in rigs with 50' Beneteau's? I don't profess to know the design intimately and this boat specifically but I have seen very strong rigs, inmast and then others that appear to be lighter on Beneteau's. Taking that you know the boats rig what you say is sensible and with your knowledge you may be able to answer the OP's original question. Can he do away with the baby stay in lighter weather or is the mast absolutely dependant on the baby stay to stay put? Off the OP's topic I know but here's a question from me. What do you think the reasoning behind Beneteau making a boat for cruising with a rig that needs a baby stay to stay up when it could have been just as easily designed to go without one? or is it not designed for serious cruising and more for the sailing that the OP mentions?

26-06-2015, 19:46
Boat: Valiant 42	or . The few seconds rolling up and back out are not that important on a long . Faced with dozens of short tacks back and forth to get up a channel most "serious" cruisers turn on the iron genny. They probably need to charge the anyway. Bene has probably thought all this through and arrived at a rig that makes most cruisers happy. I did not say all but most. Else they would not sell more cruising boats than any other .

26-06-2015, 20:58
Boat: Norfolk 43	or . The few seconds rolling up and back out are not that important on a long . Faced with dozens of short tacks back and forth to get up a channel most "serious" cruisers turn on the iron genny. They probably need to charge the anyway. Bene has probably thought all this through and arrived at a rig that makes most cruisers happy. I did not say all but most. Else they would not sell more cruising boats than any other . I think we have some confusion between a baby stay and an inner forestay here. The OP posted the question whether he could take away the baby stay in light weather, not an inner forestay which your makes perfect sense for.

26-06-2015, 21:17

Boat: CSY 44 Tall rig Sold!

Was there only one choice in rigs with 50' Beneteau's? I don't profess to know the design intimately and this boat specifically but I have seen very strong rigs, inmast and then others that appear to be lighter on Beneteau's.

Taking that you know the boats rig what you say is sensible and with your knowledge you may be able to answer the OP's original question. Can he do away with the baby stay in lighter weather or is the mast absolutely dependant on the baby stay to stay put?

Off the OP's topic I know but here's a question from me. What do you think the reasoning behind Beneteau making a boat for cruising with a rig that needs a baby stay to stay up when it could have been just as easily designed to go without one? or is it not designed for serious cruising and more for the sailing that the OP mentions?

28-06-2015, 14:57
Boat: Farr 1020	company if the stay was not connected. Best option would be to look at what causes the difficulties in tacking - where things get hung-up and then see what can be done. Typical is the bowlines on the - change to soft eyes. If you do not fly a sail from the stay (as in a cutter) then you can rig a PVC tube to act as a roller (I have added this on both my Fwd lowers and Cap shrouds). If it is just on the bottle screws, you can create a soft cover. Alternatively, part-roll the genoa as you tack. Back the genoa, or release it earl, whichever works. There are normally ways to make life easier and they end-up saving on the wear and tear, so reduce the costs. . Roger

28-06-2015, 20:17
Boat: Beneteau 473	fittings. Then running the separate wires to the gunnel at an appropriate location. That way I retain the intent of the stay but get the space back. There are times when I would like my on deck and its 13 feet long.

28-06-2015, 21:12

Boat: CSY 44 Tall rig Sold!

on deck and its 13 feet long.

29-06-2015, 00:34
Boat: Beneteau 473

29-06-2015, 08:46
Boat: CSY 44 Tall rig Sold!	tracks are Deep inboard in the deck or close to the gunels or in top of the cap rail, but be sure dont interfere with the jib ... good luck..

29-06-2015, 21:02
Boat: We have a problem... A serious addiction issue.	for the Beneteau 381 which uses the same babysta. It is not removable, and taking it off is highly discouraged. Not just for mast , but also structural support even in <10kn. His feeling was that if I took it off I should just go ahead and call the company about needing a new mast. Apparently a number of owners have tried it, and a lot of new rigs have been the result. Of course if the insurance company finds out why it fell you will be paying out of pocket.

29-06-2015, 21:20
	rig. The baby stay was used for mast bend. None of them had a that could be used for a staysail. (Luke Foxe)

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Electric Candela hydrofoil boat sets world record by crossing Baltic Sea

September 16, 2024
2 minute read
Joshua S. Hill

An all-electric hydrofoiling boat from Swedish company Candela has set two new world records by travelling between Stockholm and the Finnish autonomous region of Åland, marking the first time an electric boat has crossed the Baltic Sea.

Candela, which has developed a range of electric hydrofoil boats and ships, wanted to demonstrate that “that zero-emission sea travel is not only possible today, but that foiling electric ships and boats are so much cheaper to operate than fossil-fuelled vessels.”

The record-breaking journey was undertaken in the Candela C-8, a €330,000 ($A544,500) leisure craft, equipped with a battery from technology partner Polestar.

The journey covered 150 nautical miles from the port of Frihamn in Stockholm, Sweden, to Mariehamn, the capital and largest town of the Åland Islands, an autonomous region of Finland, with a charging stop in Kapellskär.

While charging along the trip was made mostly with existing charging infrastructure, a 40kW Kempower Movable Charger was needed in Kapellskär.

Leaving from Frihamn at 6am, the Candela C-8 made it to Mariehamn by lunchtime, and returned to Frihamn the same day.

YouTube : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hFoRF_Q0CA

“The disadvantage of electric boats has been their short range, due to traditional boat hulls consuming so much energy,” said Gustav Hasselskog , the company’s CEO and founder.

“With our hydrofoil technology, we combine high speed and range, but you get so many other benefits. Flying over the Åland Sea in total silence and without slamming was absolutely magical.”

A gasoline-powered chase boat of similar size accompanied the Candela C-8 on the journey and had to be refuelled for a cost of €750, or around $A1,230. For comparison, the Candela C-8 consumed 213 kWh of electricity, at a cost of about €40-50 (around $A66-83).

“We actually had range anxiety, but not for the Candela,” said Gustav Hasselskog.

“The irony is that the photographer’s gasoline-powered chase boat had to refuel six times during the trip, while we only charged three times.

“We’re talking about 95% lower operating costs,” concluded Hasselskog. “This is a revolution that makes waterborne transöport competitive with land transport in terms of costs, which we will now demonstrate in public transport in Stockholm.”

Joshua S. Hill is a Melbourne-based journalist who has been writing about climate change, clean technology, and electric vehicles for over 15 years. He has been reporting on electric vehicles and clean technologies for Renew Economy and The Driven since 2012. His preferred mode of transport is his feet.

We are definitely in an age of disruption, as much as the bashers, critics and cynics like to deny it. Amazing, 1/25th the cost of their ICE partner boat! And quieter, cleaner and calmer too boot!

Google informs me a litre of diesel is € 1.668, so that trip would have used ~450 litres of diesel, or 4,500 kWh. That’s shockingly inefficient.

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How has Italy reduced small boat arrivals by more than 60% in a year – and what is the Albania scheme?

Sir keir starmer says he is looking to italy for answers on how to reduce channel crossings, article bookmarked.

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Keir Starmer is meeting in Rome with Italy’s prime minister Giorgia Meloni

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Sir Keir Starmer has claimed that Britain can learn lessons from Italy on how to reduce migration , after far-right prime minister Giorgia Meloni ’s administration saw small boat arrivals fall by more than 60 per cent this year.

Ahead of a visit to Rome , Sir Keir hailed Italy’s “dramatic” drop in unregulated migration and expressed interest in Ms Meloni’s proposed asylum processing scheme in Albania, just months after scrapping the Tories’ controversial Rwanda scheme .

Claiming that his talks with Ms Meloni had marked a return to “British pragmatism”, Sir Keir also praised Italy’s “upstream work” in north Africa, saying: “I have always made the argument that preventing people leaving their country in the first place is far better than trying to deal with those that have arrived.”

Reducing the number of perilous small-boat crossings across the Channel is a political priority for the Labour government, which has announced its intention to “smash” people-smuggling gangs but has stopped short of opening safe alternative routes for asylum seekers to travel to Britain to have their claims heard.

The prime minister is now looking to Italy’s example, where the country’s interior ministry reported a 62 per cent fall in migrant arrivals on Italian coasts over the first seven months of 2024. Frontex , the EU’s border force, has calculated a 64 per cent fall in the number of people arriving from north Africa to Italy and Malta.

More than 1,000 people arrived in the UK after crossing the Channel over the weekend, as eight people died trying to make the journey

Hardline immigration policies

Italy has long struck a hard line against migration, with deputy prime minister Matteo Salvini having tightened asylum seekers’ access to support and public services. He could now face six years in jail for preventing a boat carrying more than 100 people from docking in Italy in 2019.

But the country’s hardline policies and rhetoric had failed to prevent cross-Mediterranean migration to Italy from continuing to rise dramatically until the fall seen this year, which has been widely attributed to controversial deals struck with the north African nations from which most boats depart.

While Italy has strengthened ties with Libya and is training and equipping the Libyan coastguard, the EU last year pledged €105m (£88m) to Tunisia to stop migrant crossings from setting off. However, Tunisia later said it had handed back some €60m of EU budget support amid a row over the funding.

Human rights observers have since warned that EU funds are being used by countries including Tunisia to carry out “collective expulsions” of migrants, including people intercepted at sea en route to Italy, who are then put on buses and dumped in remote or desert areas.

Migrants are stopped by the Tunisian maritime national guard at sea during an attempt to get to Italy last year

And as part of the crackdown on crossings that has been funded by Europe, the UN’s International Organisation for Migration warned this year that it believed some 15,000 to 20,000 migrants had become stranded in rural areas near the central Tunisian coastline.

Human Rights Watch has also accused Italy and the EU of being “complicit” in crimes carried out against migrants intercepted at sea and returned to Libya, where the UN has warned they faced “murder, enforced disappearance, torture, enslavement, sexual violence, rape, and other inhumane acts”.

Italy’s supreme court ruled this year that it is unlawful for Italy to return intercepted ships to Libya as it is not a safe country. That ruling followed long-running attempts by Rome to make it more difficult for charities rescuing migrants at sea to operate, including handing them fines for refusing to cooperate with the Libyan authorities.

The fall in arrivals in Italy this year has also corresponded with a rise in arrivals via the shorter eastern Mediterranean route to Greece of nearly 57 per cent, according to the EU’s border agency Frontex. These crossings previously fell under an EU deal with Turkey in 2016.

Warning that Italy’s apparent fall in numbers must be put into context, Alberto-Horst Neidhardt, a migration specialist at the European Policy Centre think tank, noted that this year’s figures are in comparison with a significant surge seen in 2023, while the fact that overall arrivals to the EU have remained roughly static suggests that the flows of migration have merely shifted elsewhere.

Mr Neidhart told The Independent that the reduction in arrivals is due to a combination of factors, including the obstruction of Mediterranean rescue operations and more vigorous efforts by Tunisia to prevent departures and return migrants to their countries of origin.

But he warned that the deals such as those with Tunisia and Libya are “short-term patchy remedies that treat the symptoms and not the root causes of irregular migration”, and that they “serve the purpose of saving the face of European governments by keeping their most unacceptable side-effects, including violations of human rights, as far away as possible from European voters’ eyes”.

Mr Neidhart added: “There is also ample evidence that pouring money and resources into unstable countries governed by authoritarian regimes only makes the problem worse in the longer term, promoting elites’ economic interests, fuelling corruption, and undermining good governance.”

Italian prime minister Giorgia Meloni with British prime minister Keir Starmer

Italy’s Albania deal

In a further bid to cut migration to Italy, Ms Meloni has struck a deal with Albania to create an offshore asylum processing system, which is yet to come to fruition.

In an echo of the controversy around the UK’s costly and long-delayed Rwanda scheme, Human Rights Watch has described Italy’s scheme – initially intended to become operational in May – as a “model of mismanagement and a blueprint for abuse” costing hundreds of millions of euros.

But with Sir Keir now expressing interest in replicating the Albania deal, home secretary Yvette Cooper insisted on Monday that it is “very, very different” from the axed Rwanda plan.

Under the Tory scheme, asylum seekers would have been permanently deported to Rwanda. By contrast, Albania will accept asylum seekers on Italy’s behalf while their claims are processed. Failed asylum seekers from safe countries will then be returned to those countries, while those whose asylum claims are successful – expected to be a small minority – will be brought to Italy.

Italian prime minister Giorgia Meloni during her joint press conference with Keir Starmer at Villa Doria Pamphili in Rome

Criticising the Albania scheme, Judith Sunderland of Human Rights Watch said in June: “Italy’s latest gambit to offshore its responsibilities is all but guaranteed to violate people’s rights.

“Following its abusive deal with Libya, Italy now wants to take people who have effectively reached the country outside of the EU, breaching fundamental tenets of rescue at sea and undermining asylum rights and freedom from arbitrary detention.”

Both Ms Sunderland and Mr Neidhart warned that the scheme was unlikely to deter people from making dangerous boat crossings, with the latter adding: “In fact, most of the persons processed in Albania will be transferred to Italy, after their procedure is over.

“The deal should be seen for what it is: a costly operation that moves the processing of claims outside the Italian territory, with questionable administrative benefits, ... intended to demonstrate to the Italian electorate that the government is acting on its pledge to crack down against irregular migration.

“It should also be seen as a deliberate and more concerted attempt to create a hostile environment for those arriving irregularly in Europe, at a time of growing social and political divisions and tensions.”

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Practical Boat Owner's Reader to Reader

Forestay and baby stay tension

Thread starter crown22
Start date 5 Jul 2018

Hello New to me sailing boat has had the mast re-stepped very quickly by the boatyard.At present the baby stay which goes about four fifths up the mast is bar tight almost but the main forestay is slack with about an inch or two of movement half way up. Should the forestay have less movement in it than the babystay?Thanks

Well-known member

The two stays do different things. suggest you slacken off the babystay, tension the forestay by by adjusting the backstay. The babystay and the aft lower shrouds should then be tensioned so that the mast is straight with no bend in the middle. You will find more detail on setting up your rigging on the Selden website.

Do you actually need the babystay? Most boats only have them if an owner has retro fitted them. If you are not going to use it you could remove it and that will make it easier to tack the overlapping headsail. If it is for a storm jib, then the best idea is to fit a Highfield lever and secure the stay near the base of the mast when not in use. If it is a retro-fit item its a good idea to check that whoever fitted it put an adequate backing plate under the deck fitting.

sailaboutvic

A lot going to depend on your boat and if a head sail furler or hank on jib , if you need any rake or bend . I would start with slacking off all the screw and get your mast up right and in the middle , then if it's isn't a racer I would tighten up each one counting the thread until your happy it's tight enough , then take it out in about 10 knot first on one tack then the other , if you find there any slackness take up a couple of turns , go on the other tack and do the same again . There other ways like measuring your shrouds about 1 meter and it measuring the distance, from the bottle screw or you go to the expense of buying springs or pay a rigger to do it for you , but what ever way you do it you have to start with getting the mast straight and in the centre.

Norman_E said: Do you actually need the babystay? Most boats only have them if an owner has retro fitted them. If you are not going to use it you could remove it and that will make it easier to tack the overlapping headsail. If it is for a storm jib, then the best idea is to fit a Highfield lever and secure the stay near the base of the mast when not in use. If it is a retro-fit item its a good idea to check that whoever fitted it put an adequate backing plate under the deck fitting. Click to expand...

crown22 said: Hello New to me sailing boat has had the mast re-stepped very quickly by the boatyard.At present the baby stay which goes about four fifths up the mast is bar tight almost but the main forestay is slack with about an inch or two of movement half way up. Should the forestay have less movement in it than the babystay?Thanks Click to expand...

ghostlymoron

Rig tensioning or tuning is a bit of a black art. The Selden guide is a good starting point but only covers the basics and doesn't do ketch rigs at all if they have a triatic otherwise treat main and mizzen as completely separate. Some of the recommended tensions are scarily high for an old boat. I find the simple method described on "Cox engineering" website (now renamed) is easier to follow.

I wouldn't want to sail a boat where the mast wasn't properly controlled in the centre. The baby stay failed one our one-time Sadler 29 after some years and I got the impression that it was doing quite a lot of work. Fortunately, it gave some warning by partly unravelling before failing completely..

Googling the images seems like some have fore and aft lower shrounds and some have just aft and a babystay. So, to the OP check which you have. If you only have aft lowers then the babystay is essential. However it is unlikely to be fitted if you have F&A shrouds.

Tranona said: Googling the images seems like some have fore and aft lower shrounds and some have just aft and a babystay. So, to the OP check which you have. If you only have aft lowers then the babystay is essential. However it is unlikely to be fitted if you have F&A shrouds. Click to expand...

As said a inner fore stay 4/5 way up the mast is most likely a stay to carry a small storm jib and as such is usually disconnected to give freedom of moving the jib across when tacking. An inner fore stay will usually be from the centre of the mast or centre of the distance between fore stay and base. Now a mast generally needs to be supported in the middle both sideways and fore and aft. Usually there will be intermediate side stays attached aft of the mast so they support the mast sideways but also pull the middle back. A baby or inner forestay from the same point will pull the middle forward. Or alternatively 2 stays pulling from forward of the mast will do the same job. An alternative often seen on fractional rig boats is to have the spreaders swing aft from abeam to meet cap shrouds which have chain plates aft of the aft. So the spreaders lean on or are pushed by the cap shroud to push the middle of the mast forward. Needs robust stiff spreaders. All this for a mast which needs support in the middle. If the mast has a large dimension in the fore and aft direction it may be stiff enough to not need middle forward support. As usually seen in racing dinghies. For the OP a baby fore stay attached 4/5 way up the mast will put a lot of load on that section of the mast not other wise supported. ie it will bend the mast from the attachment point forward. Mast may be considered stiff enough but generally it is desirable to support the mast at that point backwards and sideways. Often by running back stays. Hence for storm conditions you may set up a fore stay at 4/5 height and then set up running back stays to support it. The loads being large with a storm jib attached. Much more common is the middle inner fore stay which as said is set up in tension to make the mast straight or slightly middle forward bend. (in conjunction with the intermediate stays. Often the inner fore stay is made adjustable by tackle or handle on a turn screw so that more mast bend can be applied in stronger winds to flatten the main sail in conjunction with adjustable back stay. olewill

Thanks Guys for the information.My concern was that the boatyard may not have attached the forestay close enough to the deck and that there would not be enough adjustment on the backstay.The baby stay should not be that tight because everybody seems to agree that it's main function is to fit a storm jib to?Yes it's a Colvic Sailor 26 and the babystay was probably a retro fit so I will try to check suitability of the backing plate.Will release tension on the babystay slowly and take up the backstay until full adjustment is used.If the forestay is still slack at that point I guess my concern about the forestay not being close enough to the deck may be correct?Hoping to avoid the mast having to be supported by a strop while the forestay is disconnected and re-positioned if this turns out to be necessary.

crown22 said: Thanks Guys for the information.My concern was that the boatyard may not have attached the forestay close enough to the deck and that there would not be enough adjustment on the backstay.The baby stay should not be that tight because everybody seems to agree that it's main function is to fit a storm jib to?Yes it's a Colvic Sailor 26 and the babystay was probably a retro fit so I will try to check suitability of the backing plate.Will release tension on the babystay slowly and take up the backstay until full adjustment is used.If the forestay is still slack at that point I guess my concern about the forestay not being close enough to the deck may be correct? Hoping to avoid the mast having to be supported by a strop while the forestay is disconnected and re-positioned if this turns out to be necessary . Click to expand...

You don't say where and how the inner stay (is is not a baby stay from the way you have described it). Normally an inner stay for a storm jib is mounted to the deck aft of the forestay, often some way back to pick up on a bulkhead and attached with a lever so that it can be removed when not in use. It is usually then brought back to the mast or a shroud. The orestay needs to be tight independent of an inner stay. If you do not have a storm jib you can remove this inner stay completely. Most Colvics I have seen in images have forward and aft lower shrouds so do not need a baby stay.

14 Jul 2018

Second picture showing shrouds has failed to upload.Will try to compress file size?

crown22 said: Hello Guys two pictures attached.Am waiting for the boatyard people to come on board to shorten my floppy forestay. In the meantime I have tied the headsail halyard to the pulpit as extra backup.I am hoping that they will either find some extra adjustment inside the furling drum or will cut and shorten the attaching plate with holes in (does this have a name?) Don't want to do the job myself in case the mast comes down on top of me or my neighbour's boat! View attachment 72105 Click to expand...

That inner forestay is removable by unclipping the lever. It is totally unnecessary on the boat. It was probably installed by an owner who had dreams of sailing oceans and wanted the ability to both use a storm job orfly twin sails downwind. Neither of those particularly valuable on the lake, nor indeed common set ups for coastal sailing. so, once you get the forestay sorted out suggest you release it and stow it at the mast then consider removing it completely. It will however support the mast completely and you could remove the forestay safely to sort out the bottom end fixings as Vic suggests.

15 Jul 2018

Spirit (of Glenans)

VicS said: It is, I notice, a Plastimo furler They are supplied with a choice of two length of "side plares" ( IIRC 5 hole or 11 hole) The longer version is designed to fit around an existing bottle screw. The shorter version is designed to fit when there is no bottle screw on the forestay. The length of the side plates as such do do adjust the forestay tension they only only set the height of the drum above the stem head fitting. You appear to have a collection of shackles on the forestay. Not good! Toggles should be used when necessary to extend the stay and to provide articulation. However if the collection shackles cannot be replaced with a bottle screw, ( hopefully there are not that many up inside the drum), the simple solution will probably be to reduce the number of shackles ( and replace those that remain with toggles) and shorten the side plates by a few holes Plastimo gear is designed to be easily fitted DIY and there is no reason why you could not easily sort this out yourself with some basic hand tools ( Small adjustable spanner, pair of pliers and a hacksaw probably all you'd need) I have to say that Plastimo gear is fitted in a variety of, often ghastly, ways by people who dont seem to be able to read the instructions. I once went round the boat yard photographing some of the results. Not many were fitted exactly as per the instructions. Some were terrible. Yours may not be the worst I have seen but is is pretty poor ! If you do get the boat yard rigger to sort it out photograph the results and post the photo. Click to expand...

Tranona said: That inner forestay is removable by unclipping the lever. It is totally unnecessary on the boat. It was probably installed by an owner who had dreams of sailing oceans and wanted the ability to both use a storm job orfly twin sails downwind. Neither of those particularly valuable on the lake, nor indeed common set ups for coastal sailing. so, once you get the forestay sorted out suggest you release it and stow it at the mast then consider removing it completely. It will however support the mast completely and you could remove the forestay safely to sort out the bottom end fixings as Vic suggests. Click to expand...

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27 Aug 2024

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COMMENTS

purpose of baby stay?
My recently acquired boat came with what was deswcribed as a 'quick-release' baby stay. A full-thickness wire stay attached with a snap shackle and rigging with a fold-out handle, to tension/detension the stay. Runs from a deck u-bolt about 5ft in front of the mast up to the spreaders.
Babystay: how do we use it?
Anarchist. What the baby stay does is pull the mid section of the mast forward. your checkstays stop it from going to far / pull the mid section of the mast aft. When the mid section goes forward the main flattens, leech opens up, and depowers. When the mid goes aft, the main deepens and hence powers up.
Baby stay
Oct 2, 2008. 3,809. Pearson/ 530 Strafford, NH. Jun 24, 2014. #4. I have baby stays with our cutter rig and was told it would reduce mast pumping when the staysail was used with no headsail going downwind. Our mast rarely pumps due to being heavily built. We keep our baby stay pulled forward out of the way. All U Get.
Purpose of a baby stay?
There are two lowers on each side, one forward of the mast position and one aft of the mast position. Some boats have a rig with a single lower and a babystay instead of forward lowers. This babystay replaces the forward lowers and is essential to the stability of the rig. On these rigs the existing lower is either aft of the mast or even with ...
Standing Rigging (or 'Name That Stay')
A sailboat's standing rigging is generally built from wire rope, rod, or occasionally a super-strong synthetic fibered rope such as Dyneema ®, carbon fiber, kevlar or PBO. 1×19 316 grade stainless steel Wire Rope (1 group of 19 wires, very stiff with low stretch) is standard on most sailboats. Wire rope is sized/priced by its diameter which ...
Baby Stay
41,815. Visit site. The baby stay is there for a reason as mrming says. Although you could make it removable for light airs it really is essential for security of the rig. It was a very popular rig at the time your boat was built as it means you don't need forward lowers to support the middle of the spar.
How to Tune a Sailboat Mast
Making this baby stay removable is a good idea, as well as, we've found that Dynema rope is the best choice here. So… a centered mast head, side to side. A straight, in column mast from the top on down. A slight aft rake to start with…and as you begin to wind on the backstay and the baby stay you will add some rake but also a good bit ...
PDF 15 Hints and advice
Baby stay:Attached in the region of the lower spreaders. The stay is not sail-carrying, but is intended to stay the lower panel of the mast fore-and-aft, in conjunction with ... On smaller yachts, the stay is led through a block at the mizzen mast top down to the deck, where the length can be adjusted. Cap shrouds: (V1-V3, D4) ...
Keep the baby stay, or?
baby stay The role of the baby stay is to pull the middle of the mast forward counteracting the pull aft of the intermediate side stays (chain plates aft of abeam the mast) so between them holding the middle of the mast in place. assuming one spreader rig. ... Down each side of the boat, how many cables and bottle screws do you have? My little ...
baby stay vs. inner forestay tension
What rules of thumb are there regarding how to set the baby stay and inner forestay tension? I have a hydraulic backstay tensioner - should the hydraulic pretension be removed prior to tensioning the baby stay vs. inner forestay tension - Cruisers & Sailing Forums
Placement of babystay..
My boat came with a removable baby stay and additional running backstays, the uppers of which were attached via T-ball fittings about 3/4 of the way up the mast. The baby stay has a hyfield lever for adjustment and has its own halyard tensioned by a mast-mounted winch that is shared with the main halyard. The running backstays are attached to ...
Baby Stay
Jan 26, 2005. 1,259. C&C 110 Bay Shore, Long Island, NY. Jan 11, 2024. #4. shemandr said: Sailboatdata.com doesn't show that boat with a baby stay'. The line drawing on Sailboatdata.com clearly shows a baby stay for this boat. There are lower aft shrouds but no forward lower shrouds.
Baby Stay setup, how does this one work?
Most trailerable sailboats have a set of baby stays that attach to a hound about 6-7 feet off the deck and to the stantion bases at the beam. The same hound is used with a winch attached to raise and lower the mast, the baby stays keep the mast from swinging too far to port or starboard and twisting the mast base plate.
Sail on a baby stay?
Messages. 13,857. Location. West Australia. Visit site. Any one contemplating running a sail on typical baby forestay (half mast height) should be able to tell if the deck where the baby stay attaches s strong enough. Baby stay should be designed to be loaded up to bend the middle of the mast forward. So sould be strong.
Baby stay question
Baby Stay Question and other sailing discussion in the Seabreeze general forums, page 1. Forums > Sailing > > General. Subs Active Search New Topic. Subscribed Topics Active Topics Search New Topic. ... My boat has an inner forstay but it is permanently attached with a roller furler fitted. It is a cruising boat and would not be suitable for ...
Baby Stay
I have a "Baby Stay" on my B381 that I would like to use to hang a storm jim if needed but not sure if it's designed for that. It also has a protective tube/sleeve for the first 5 feet or so that would have to be removed. I would hate to have to lower the genoa and raise a storm jib on the headstay in the storm.
Baby stay
also, tracks usually suck if you want to use the baby stay to control pre-bend and main sail shape. if you want to play with it properly, get a cacading 4:1 with a 64:1 cascade tweaker and leed the lines back to an ape in the pit. Attach the whole thing to your well-reneforced bulkhead with a snap shackle.
Baby Stay
I have just upgraded my boat and the new girl has a Baby-Stay. I can see that it it set up such that it's tension can be adjusted easily, or it can be diconnected. What I am struggeling with it what it is there for in the first place. I have scoured a number of books and little refernece is made to a Baby-Stay, the few time it is mentioned it ...
Baby stay really necessary?
Many racing masts would not survive without a baby stay. A serious 30 to 70ft cruising boat should never be designed to have a baby stay as it is a unnecessary inconvenience on a cruising boat. And that is the crux of the matter. The Bene's, as with most mass produced boats, are not designed for serious ocean cruising. This is not a Bene bash.
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Forestay and baby stay tension
Well-known member. Joined. 10 Nov 2007. Messages. 41,849. Visit site. The two stays do different things. suggest you slacken off the babystay, tension the forestay by by adjusting the backstay. The babystay and the aft lower shrouds should then be tensioned so that the mast is straight with no bend in the middle.

Standing Rigging (or ‘Name That Stay’)

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Baby Stay setup, how does this one work?

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Forestay and baby stay tension

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